Thomas Waldrom replaces Billy Vunipola, who suffered a concussion playing for Saracens at the weekend, in the extended England squad for the Australia game this weekend.
Fly half Stephen Myler, who kicked 16 points for Saints in their victory over Sarries, regains a place in the squad after a hamstring strain. Courtney Lawes (also Northampton Saints) continues to be treated in camp for a knee injury suffered against Samoa.
England squad for Australia game
Loose-head props
Joe Marler (Harlequins)
Matt Mullan (Wasps)
Tight-head props
Kieran Brookes (Newcastle Falcons)
David Wilson (Bath Rugby)
Hookers
Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints)
Rob Webber (Bath Rugby)
Locks
Dave Attwood (Bath Rugby)
Graham Kitchener (Leicester Tigers)
George Kruis (Saracens)
Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints)
Back rows
Calum Clark (Northampton Saints)
James Haskell (Wasps)
Ben Morgan (Gloucester Rugby)
Chris Robshaw (Harlequins, captain)
Thomas Waldrom (Exeter Chiefs)
Tom Wood (Northampton Saints)
Scrum halves
Danny Care (Harlequins)
Lee Dickson (Northampton Saints)
Richard Wigglesworth (Saracens)
Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)
Outside backs
Brad Barritt (Saracens)
Luther Burrell (Northampton Saints)
Kyle Eastmond (Bath Rugby)
Owen Farrell (Saracens)
George Ford (Bath Rugby)
Stephen Myler (Northampton Saints)
Billy Twelvetrees (Gloucester Rugby)
Back threes
Mike Brown (Harlequins)
Alex Goode (Saracens)
Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby)
Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs)
Semesa Rokoguduni (Bath Rugby)
Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby)
Marland Yarde (Harlequins)
Waldrom? OK, I know he’s had a new lease of life since joining Exeter, but he’s a known quantity and whilst he would be ok in an emergency, I see no point in having him in the squad
I’d much prefer to see Dave Ewers take the spot
Hi pablito,either Ewers,who to be fair has been playing at 6 this season or Sam Dickinson from Saints?
My team for Australia (thoughts?)
1. Joe Marler
2. Dylan Hartley
3.David Wilson
4. Dave Attwood
5. Courtney Lawes
6. James Haskell
7.Chris Robshaw ©
8. Ben Morgan
9. Ben Young’s
10. George Ford
11. Johnny May
12. Kyle Eastmond
13. Luther Burrell
14. Anthony Watson
15. Mike Brown
16. Rob Webber
17. Matt Mullan
18. Keiron Brooke’s
19. George Kruis
20. Tom Wood/Thomas Waldrom (don’t mind here)
21. Danny Care
22. Owen Farrell
23. Semesa Rockodunguni
I’m struggling with the half backs for the bench, everything else I would agree with. For me, Care and Farrell have been way off the standards they set which made them starters in the 6N. There’s the option of playing 2 club partnerships in Wigglesworth/Farrell and Dickson/Myler, but neither of those appear to be impact partnerships, even when on form, capable of sparking a team into a comeback, which is what I would want from a bench, rather than changes to maintain a narrow lead.
I agree that impact players are what we need on the bench which is why I opted for Care over Dickson, Wigglesworth etc. As he has that impact capability. While he may not be completely on form I believe he can kickstart the match again. Just needs to improve his box kicking and game management
Joe
I 100% agree.I am delighted with your 12 and 13.
Agree on that starting line-up but replace Farrell with 36. We definitely need to see what the dynamism of the Ford/Eastmond combo can do with some proper bosh outside them. At least Burrell has a good offload game too.
Whilst I still don’t think Farrell is fully fit – I think there was enough in that partnership between him and Ford that I’d like to see it again. Apparently it was Farrell who called the Watson cross-field kick, and things like that are so valuable – even if we can not see it from watching on tv.
I’d swap round Hartley and Webber, whilst bring Care onto the bench. Outside of that – the 23 would be exactly the same for me. Maybe Eastmond onto the bench for Twelvetrees.
Ford was very good but did miss that pretty easy kick on half time. Farrell can take those duties next week when every point will be valuable.
I actually think it is cruel to keep picking Farrell, whilst he is so out of sorts. You’ve now got fans cheering when he gets subbed. That’s not right. The missed tackle and lazy penalty to me epitomised a player whose head is not right. Test rugby is very unforgiving and he needs to find some form for Sarries.
I do agree with lots of that – he clearly isn’t right at the moment. Maybe Ford and Eastmond will get the job done between the two of them. If anyone, Australia are the team to put those two against. Australia won’t physically dominate that channel in the way NZ or SA could have done.
Waldrom? Really? It seems clear to me that England are struggling at the breakdown, wouldn’t Fraser have been a better bet?
1. Joe Marler
2. Dylan Hartley
3. David Wilson
4. Dave Attwood
5. Courtney Lawes
6. Callum Clark (controversial I know, but in the absence of Fraser, he is the one player in the squad to improve the breakdown)
7.Chris Robshaw ©
8. Ben Morgan
9. Ben Youngs
10. George Ford
11. Johnny May
12. Billy 12T(Billy & Luther worked well in the 6n, plus we avoid more tedious articles in MSM over “yet another centre partnership)
13. Luther Burrell
14. Anthony Watson
15. Mike Brown
16. Rob Webber
17. Matt Mullan
18. Keiron Brookes
19. George Kruis
20. James Haskell
21. Danny Care
22. Owen Farrell
23. Semesa Rockodunguni
Clarke – very interesting one. He is absolutely brilliant at the breakdown, no doubt about that. I do think Haskell can be better than he was against Samoa. He is a one man breakdown machine for Wasps, allowing Johnson and Hughes to roam. Just player wise, Clarke probably deserves a shot, but can we ignore his history? I think selecting him for a game of this magnitude will bring an awful lot of media attention over what happened with Hawkins – which really isn’t ideal.
Would you not rather see Eastmond come back in over Twelvetrees? To me he seems the better option.
Clark woudl be controversial for the reasons you give, and it doesn’t sit well with me, but as Fraser is deemed surplus to requirments and Haskell had an absolute stinker, Clark it is.
Haskell was a big disappointment. I really bigged him up to my brother in law who is not a fan, noting how well he played for Wasps this season, but this was back to brainless Haskell. When a ref shouts “hands off” take your effing hands off. Its not complicated.
I chose 12t above Eastmond, purely because they played the whole 6n together, plus 12t does provide another kicking option, but I woudln’t be upset to see Eastmond there.
I’d have Farrell on the bench. It would be a bench in a park in Hounslow mind you…
Nice!!
Hope George Ford starts again really don’t mind whether its Eastmond or Twelvetree paired with whoever it is. With Ford we begin to have more attacking potential. So can’t wait to see when all the injured players come back around Ford.
Lawes has been disappointing it just seems like he can only be paired with Launchberry, but feel Kruis is not a good choice to start alongside Attwood against Wallabies. Our scrumhalves not sure who should start Youngs was not really that good at all, Wiggleworth really did not look international but neither do any of our scrumhalf. Not really sure if we should call Dickson in for 1 last game.
Most of our wings have looked really promising with May but may still be a problem under the high ball, Yarde did break a couple of tackles when he came on but then made a mistake, Watson is still learning the game. Nowell has been looking good for Exter, but Rokoduguni not sure if he should start but feels he deserve another chance.
Joe K
Lots of feedback already, but for yr yr team is esp positive in midfield where England must have more skill & generate space for the wings who are a willing bunch. Ford must start (but with Lancs?), but it should have been with Cip at least on the bench. If Farrell’s been shunted because of his lack of variety (& skill), why have him clogging up the works. Halves ok, but wouldn’t GI Joe Simpson’s jet shoes catch someone out? Hopefully not his own! Back row need to impose more, esp as my fav, Steff Armitage, won’t feature… unless the RFU do an Oz on SL! Also is Marler so good that Matt Mullan can’t get more than run on? Again, for me it’s not just the team tho, but the coaching. Compare SL with JS of Ireland. Get the pt? Well, they’re (some of) my ‘thoughts’ which you asked for.
Don P,
I think the point here is to pick a team from the squad available. Thus avoifding the endless discussion as to merits of one player (read Cip/Armitage) over another (read Farrell/Robson/Wood/Waldrom). This avoids endlessly recovering the same arguement again and agian and again.
Particularly relevant when Armitage would not be available for this game, whether Lancaster wanted him, for the same reason that a SA and Wales will be fielding B teams
Mike, Wales hopefully won’t be a B team. We won’t have Hibbard, Hook, James. The latter two may not have appeared anyway. North is there and we have release for all of the France based players.
Injuries might scupper us but that’s no different to other weekends.
I do hope that SA select a B team. Sod “wanting to play the best”, I just want to win one now. We can play their A team in the future.
I got caught up in the flow, and the point seemed better made by employing a bit of hyperbole. “B team” was easier than “A minus 1/4 team” or “not quite A team”
As you say, SA are only missing 3 or 4.
I had not realised however that you have release of the France based players. How did WRU engineer that?
Gats negotiated it basically. For Charteris we let him go for the Aus game. Not sure of the details of the others but the only ones I have heard that we def do not have are the English based players where we get caught up in the Prem Rugby v Everyone thing where they won’t let any player be involved in an out of window game unless it’s for their financial benefit e.g. US players released to play against the ABs.
Lancaster has confirmed Ford will start – hooray. And that Eastmond won’t be involved as he has already had two games and ‘wants to look at other options’ i.e. it’s between Farrell and 12Trees. He didn’t mention outside centre, so let’s see if he lives by his word and picks Burrell, as Barritt has already had three chances!
Mike
Well it’s the point for you maybe. Another take on it is that Lancs has lost 6 v the SH heavier hitters & it’s, @ least in part, HIS self imposed limitations that are responsible for his team availability for selection; e.g., 1 not picking outside the UK except under ‘special circs’. How special is special when he’s lost 6 you & HE, may well ask, esp with his belated b/row reshuffling?; 2 his stating that the same SH teams have so much more exp, yet HE imposed his ‘yoof’ policy! So whoever is available IS somewhat down to him. His mindset is too rigid by 1/2. Compare with J Schmidt. And every team has injuries, but they don’t have so many too choose from as England.
Indeed. That is an interesting point that you make. and so unexpected and original.
All I was trying to point out is that we are generally discussing the team for this weekend, that can only be selected from the 34 included in the training squad. And that 34 can only be selected from the EPS.
We have all discussed at length our various opinions of who should be included in the EPS, and who we would like to see in our personal fictional England team.
We are all aware of:
1) Your opinion of SL
2) Your opinion of SL’s UK only selection policy
3) Your opinion of S Armitage
4) Your opinion of the handling, physical and general rugby skills of all NH players with the exception of Cipriani and Armitage.
It is reasonable to state that your opinion on 1 – 3 is shared by a number of England fans. This is almost certainly true, as England fans are reasonably divided on all three points, especially in light of the last 6 games.
Re J Schmidt:
Since being in charge The comparable record between Ireland and England is as follows:
Vs Australia
Ireland won 1 lost 1
England won 1
Vs South Africa
Ireland won 1
England lost 1
Vs France
Ireland won 1
England lost 1
Head to head
England won 1
Ireland lost 1
To clarify my position, I think Ireland are the form NH team at the moment and fully deserve there place in the IRB rankings. I am concerned that England are actually worse than they were 4 months ago.
However, I think it would be wise to wait at least until we have played Australia, but more sensibly until we have played each other before making too many comparisons.
I was trying to (helpfully?) bring you into the discussion as your comment was limited in addressing the issues being discussed. In fact your comment seemed more to be a slightly vitrolic rant an a number of the most contraversial issues in England selection, but none of which are relevant in who is likely to play on Saturday.
If you prefer, I will assume it is trolling and ignore your comments in future.
Matt B
Gd regds Ford, early days, but so far, so goodish. However, oughtn’t Lancs be trying to WIN the game 1st, rather than looking ‘‘… at other options’’, esp after 6 losses v the SH? Hasn’t he already tried 12trees prev & ‘discarded’ him? Do not Eastmond & Burrell (for Billy 12), e.g., rate a go? What have they done wrong… or 12t for that matter? I find SL’s thinking muddled, particularly after the desperate move of pushing Farrell, an Int’al journeyman fly1/2, to inside centre!
Mike
Ok, no problem, either way, but as it’s a blog site, each to his own. We see ‘issues’ diff. For me, discussing the team is somewhat akin to Nero’s fiddling, which, from the length of yr r, r, r, reply, seems to irritate you. You want to discuss this team only & you’re so entitled. I see broader team issues for England & which, IMO, by & large haven’t been addressed by SL. However, If my comments so annoy, you are, of course, free to ignore them (like Brighty… are you watching?). However, even you can’t surely deny that this England team has issues @ back row & midfield!? So, without meaning to tread too heavily on your pinkies, is this new & is discussing this particular team, at least in part, not shuffling deck chairs? If you call this trolling, then it beats me.. or am I, perhaps, just not playing the game?
Just to try and diffuse the situation a little,the one thing we all agree on is our concern for the current state of affairs regarding the England team.
You both make valid points,the only difference being in relation to timescale ie this Saturday and the longer term.
Well put TeeCee
Don P, as you say you are entitled to blog as you wish.
And of course I acknowledge that there are probems with Englands back row and midfield. I would be delusional if I did not.
I take it I can look forward to your next post on SL, Cips and Armitage…
Don P
I think what Mike was getting at was that you have a tendency to regurgitate your opinion, over and over on each post. It is a blog site, correct, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. I don’t think anyone has any problem with you criticising the England team, i certainly don’t. The points you make are valid, and i agree with a lot of them. But they are all points you have made previously, multiple times.
TeeCee, Mike, Banastre
Are you saying there’s an echo in here then? Anyway pt taken. I suppose the issues I’ve seemed to have gone on… & on… like a nun’s knickers about are important for England though. Others here however, appear to have (relatively) ignored these whilst engaging in what I’ve perceived as (relative) minutiae, esp when the ship may be meandering. Maybe it’s a perception thing. Anyway, as a presi, I’ll do my level not to mention SL, Cips and Armitage (ooops!) again. Well, not before Xmas anyway. Cheers.